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Introduction and Questions I'm Asked >> Introduction and Art Questions >> Oil Drying times

Message started by Brownie on May 26th, 2005 at 1:18am

Title: Oil Drying times
Post by Brownie on May 26th, 2005 at 1:18am
Dear Don,
 May I ask, do you have a chart on your site about drying times for different colors of oil paint?  I find it interesting that many use some of the slowest drying colors for their underpainting work (thalo blue/aliz/diaz. purple) and wondered if that's a good idea... thought it should be slower drying over faster drying.  It's probably a dumb question, but it's something has been  bugging me enough to come to you since I know you have experimented more than anyone else I know!  It also seems the mfgs. don't cover that aspect of their products.  
  BTW, for some reason, despite using two browsers,  I only see a color chart where your messges would/should  have been.   Do I have something set incorrectly?
 Hope you've been doing great and that life is treating you wonderfully!  Brownie

Title: Re: Oil Drying times
Post by Admin on May 26th, 2005 at 6:31am
Hi Brownie,
I never made any timed drying color tests..

You're right, if you are painting over an underpainting it has to dry, half way isn't good enough. It will shrink and cause the over paint to crack or chip off. Oil itself isn't a good binder. I did test linseed oil on my car window and it was pityful. One needs a good glue, like stand oil or Venetian balsam or damar.

Umber would not be one of my choices, mold attacks it faster then any other color.

Life is good, I just spent a month in my van on our mountain painting jacaranda trees. I wanted to paint in all the media I carry with me, oil, W/C, acrylic and mastic and wax. I haven't posted any of them (12) yet because I just got back tonight.

I'll bet you have some great ones to post.

Nice to hear from you, sorry I couldn't be of more help.
Your friend,

jacamikesd9fin400.jpg (Attachment deleted)

Title: Re: Oil Drying times
Post by Brownie on Jun 3rd, 2005 at 6:44pm
Beautiful painting, Don!  

Re Oils, I did find some info.  I was particularly interested in fast drying violets/purples and found a petty interesting doc about this.  Trouble is, I am not sure of the source.  I believe it may have been the Gamblin site.  Anyway, the following is about violets and doesn't necessarily cover my drying questions, and you may have things add:


Some painters mix violet or purple using alizarin crimson and ultramarine blue, but mixtures with alizarin crimson are not lightfast and will turn blue over time.

COBALT VIOLET (Semi-transparent)
(Inorganic) Cobalt phosphate. Tinting strength low to moderate, lightfastness excellent, to very good, drying rate fast, oil absorption low. Pure violet hue that cannot be mixed. Has a hint of red but less than manganese violet. Leans towards blue when mixed with white.

MANGANESE VIOLET (Semi-transparent)
(Inorganic) Manganese ammonium phosphate. Tinting strength moderate, lightfastness excellent to very good, drying rate fast, oil absorption very high. A bit warmer than the cobalt violet.

(Inorganic) Synthetic red iron oxide with a bluish tinge. Tinting strength moderate, lightfastness excellent, drying rate average, oil absorption average.

(Organic) Quinacridone. Tinting strength high, lightfastness excellent, drying rate average, oil absorption high to average. Recently developed, brilliant color, one of the warmer violets. Also known as acra violet.

Recently developed this violet leans toward the red end of the spectrum.

Warmer than cobalt violet, cooler than manganese violet and more transparent than either.

A grayish lavender.

Now that I can get here OK, I have a question I need to post under acrylics.  Take care, Brownie

Title: Re: Oil Drying times
Post by Admin on Jun 9th, 2005 at 12:31am
Great Brownie,
I won't be able to get back up for a week or so, I'm out painting.
Thanks for the complement.
Let's see your latest.

Title: Re: Oil Drying times
Post by Brownie on Jun 9th, 2005 at 4:57pm
Sounds like you're having a great time, Don.  I often think of you and hope one day to see that beautiful place!

To make a correction, I believe the info I posted about colors was from the Winsor and Newton site, not Gamblin, though I'm still trying to find various drying times from any mfg.  It's also of interest to me that the info I found keeps mentioning "oil absorption."  Don't know what they mean...  However, somewhere in the literature it was mentioned that one shouldn't put a cadmium that has less oil over a color that has lots of oil in it.  In practical use, I'm not sure I understand its application very well.  

May I ask also if you advocate using alizarin crimson that is supposed to be "fugitive?"  Seems like almost every artist around is using it heavily in their paintings, often in the darks.  Would the Quin. Rose by Daniel Smith be a good substitute?  Few brands seem to be making a permanent alizarin.  Perhaps it is because it's difficult to make one that has a dark enough value.  The one I've tried was a much lighter value than the original alizarin crimson.

As to posting pics, have to figure out how, take some decent photos, resize them, etc.  Time, time, time!  Tonight bird club meeting...if it isn't one thing, it's another!  

BTW, I sure appreciate knowing your website covers almost every question one could have in multiple media.  You've done so much work, Don, on sharing what you have learned, you deserve great praise!  Brownie

Title: Re: Oil Drying times
Post by Admin on Jun 12th, 2005 at 9:13am
Hi Brownie,
It would give a lot better information if W/N would give the Pigment Index Color Numbers for the colors they are talking about.

Oil absorption is how much oil the dry pigment will hold. Burnt umber never seems to have enough. The manufactures never tell the ratio of oil and pigment, were lucky if they tell us what kind of oil was used.

Alizarin is a dirty color at best, just like Prussian blue is not as pure as PB15.3 cyan Thalo blue. PR122 magenta is the true magenta color. To match alizarin you might add a touch of vine black and transparent yellow. But why would you want to?

Danial Smith makes a good magenta PR122 in oil.
Liquitex makes it in acrylics.
Forget the PV19 colors if you want magenta, it makes a good Rembrandt rose though which is a little warmer.

Thanks Brownie. You're a fast learner and I know we are having fun.

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